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Nate Fisher & Steve St. Angelo: The Collapse of Increasingly Complex Societies

Today, we are once again joined by Steve St. Angelo and also Nate Fisher. Nate wants to analyze the risks involved in the energy situation of the world. It’s important to discuss the situation in bytes larger than 140 characters. The concept of this podcast is to convey awareness and figure out solutions to the potential risk factors. If an energy cliff is coming soon, how can you thoroughly prepare?

Risk analysis usually entails the concepts of accept, avoid, transfer, or mitigate.

Steve discusses his energy return on investment thesis and how modern society compares with past civilizational collapses. We’re reaching an energy cliff where declining oil production accelerates. We’re just not finding as much economic oil. At some point, we’re not going to be able to replace the declines. Oil production and the world population curve are highly correlated.

Nate discusses possible ways we could mitigate the energy cliff for a time.

Nuclear plants are more expensive and take longer to construct, and therefore we are “starting to run out that clock.” We need better battery technologies, and hopefully advances in I.T. will help bring those about. We’re in a race between a lack of energy and the promise of new technology.

Nate discusses the idea of having physical precious metals as a method of insurance.

Lastly, Steve speaks to the idea of adding complexity to solve difficult problems actually exacerbates the situation. The solution is for things to become more simple and self-sustaining on an individual level.

Talking Points From This Episode

  • Systemic risks and ways of mitigation.
  • Energy Return on Investment and potential impacts of modern civilization’s energy use.
  • ESG, resource efficiency, and energy consumption.
  • Some other promising technologies that could be beneficial.

Time Stamp References:
0:00 – Introduction
0:38 – Energy Risk Discussion
5:38 – Energy Cliff – EROI
8:58 – Energy System Waste
12:40 – Debt vs. Oil & Gas EROI
15:40 – Conservation Methods
21:15 – Green Solutions?
29:38 – Nuclear & Cheap Coal
38:33 – Green at Home?
44:20 – Moore’s Law and I.T.
52:10 – Battery Technology
55:14 – Electric Mining & Farming
1:03:56 – Supply Chains & EROI
1:10:54 – Precious Metals
1:15:33 – Various Factors
1:20:30 – Conclusion

Past Show Link with Steve:

Nate Fisher Guest Links:

Nate Fisher is an IT contract project manager living in York, PA. He has an undergrad in Information systems along with a master’s degree in cybersecurity and business administration. Nate has many side interests, including investing with precious metals, mining, and rental properties. He is a part-time blogger that writes about PMs, miners, and health and fitness. Nate is a self-described renaissance man, and you can find out more from his website and Twitter.

Steve St. Angelo – Guest Links:

Independent researcher Steve St. Angelo (SRSrocco) started to invest in precious metals in 2002. Later on, in 2008, he began researching areas of the gold and silver market that, curiously, most of the precious metal analyst community have left unexplored. These areas include how energy and the falling EROI “Energy Returned On Invested” stand to impact the mining industry, precious metals, paper assets, and the overall economy.

Steve considers studying the impacts of EROI one of the most important aspects of his energy research. For the past several years, he has written scholarly articles on some of the top precious metals and financial websites.

You can find many of Steve’s articles on noteworthy sites, such as GoldSeek-SilverSeek, Market Oracle, Financial Sense,, SilverDoctors, TFMetals Report, Outsiderclub, SGTreport, BrotherJohnF, Hartgeld, Der-Klare-Blick, PeakProsperity, SilverStrategies, DollarCollapse, FurtureMoneyTrends, Sharpspixley, FinancialSurvivalNetwork, PMBull, Deviantinvestor, PMBug, Wealthwire, and ZeroHedge.

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